Trouble casting new Money bullet

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Keith
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Trouble casting new Money bullet

Post by Keith » Mon Mar 07, 2016 4:07 pm

I havnt had much luck getting my PP Money bullet to shoot so ordered a Money greaser from BACO. Jim 459540 M3
I bought some 16 -1 alloy from the foundry, preped the mould with BACO mould prep got the pot to 800 degrees , fluxed with beeswax and started pouring with the ladel.
The first few always go back in the pot and as my ladel does not have the little spout that fits in the sprue hole I drop pour in. This usually works but here I am having trouble getting the base to fill out all the way around.
All the grooves fill nicely but the side of the base near the sprue plate handle wont fill nicely unless I raise the lade and pour from 2 inches above and tap the handles on the pot rim at the same time. I also keep pouring as it cools as mentioned in another thread.
This fills the base nicely but as expected causes whiskers.
I did not have this problem with the PP mould.
Any ideas?

Keith

gunlaker
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Re: Trouble casting new Money bullet

Post by gunlaker » Mon Mar 07, 2016 5:05 pm

I don't know if this is of any use to you as my dipper fits the sprue hole. That might be part of the trouble. But just in case this is useful:

I like 825 degrees for all of my molds that use the Saeco blocks like the BACO molds. I hold the ladle in contact with the sprue plate for 3 seconds and then pour a quarter sized puddle on the sprue opening.

Pretty much every time I've had trouble wih a BACO mold not filling out it was because the mold was dirty. I only use mold prep on the top of the blocks and away from the hole. If any of it gets into the cavity at all, it seems to clog the first few vent lines near the bullet base.
.

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Ranch 13
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Re: Trouble casting new Money bullet

Post by Ranch 13 » Mon Mar 07, 2016 6:56 pm

Almost sounds like the sprueplate is to tight.

Arnie
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Re: Trouble casting new Money bullet

Post by Arnie » Mon Mar 07, 2016 9:07 pm

Get an RCBS ladle and loosen the sprue plate a little so it vents air . Paul Jones told me years ago to hold the tip of the ladle on the mould to a count of about 3 and then raise the ladle straight up about 1/2 inch and let it pour onto the sprue hole . This makes the air bubbles come out .

Keith
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Re: Trouble casting new Money bullet

Post by Keith » Tue Mar 08, 2016 1:54 am

I did not think a sprue plate could be too tight. It was loose enough to flop open when I got it so I tightened it up a bit so I have to push it with a gloved hand. The flopping annoyed me but you might have something there as its venting better when loose. I will loosen it a bit and try again later in the week.
Thanks.
Keith

kokomokid
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Re: Trouble casting new Money bullet

Post by kokomokid » Tue Mar 08, 2016 8:17 am

Use some electric contact cleaner and a Q-tip to clean the mould. If the problem is always in the same place try rotating the mould and ladle after mating at different speeds.

Premod70
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Re: Trouble casting new Money bullet

Post by Premod70 » Thu Mar 10, 2016 6:56 pm

After reading the OP I feel a ladle with a pour spout will solve the problem with a couple hints thrown in for usage. It takes me at least twenty or more pours to bring the mold(iron) up to temperature and once there the base will not completely fill without using the spout of the ladle to compress the molten lead; I let the lead flow out of the ladle all the while lightly compressing the lead with the spout. Using this method gives me a sharp base and a very minute consistent weight variance.

martinibelgian
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Re: Trouble casting new Money bullet

Post by martinibelgian » Fri Mar 11, 2016 9:25 am

I prefer a free-swinging sprue plate, mate the nozzle of the ladle to the sprue plate and keep the temp up there. Also, I mate the ladle with the mould in horizontal position, slowly rotating it to vertical position, which should allow the air in the mould enough time to vent out. Worksfor me. In order to cast with the ladle free from the sprue plate (pressureless casting, I find that the mould/alloy temp neends to be quite a bit higher in order to get nice and sharp bases. and some of my moulds obstinately refuse to cast well in this way... I find that pressure casting is the easiest way to get consistent results.

Keith
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Re: Trouble casting new Money bullet

Post by Keith » Fri Mar 11, 2016 3:17 pm

Thanks guys.
Looks like the consensus is , I should change my ladle to a pour spout one. :)

Keith

bruce moulds
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Re: Trouble casting new Money bullet

Post by bruce moulds » Fri Mar 11, 2016 3:59 pm

you are right keith.
also, big sprues keep the plate hot, which aids in square bases.
800 degrees should be hot enough to get fillout, and if technique is good possibly 750 degrees will be good.
sometimes tilting the mated ladle/mould back and forth will induce air release.
counting to 3 as you rotate the mould/ladle from horizontal to vertical often helps as well.
keep safe,
bruce.

Keith
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Re: Trouble casting new Money bullet

Post by Keith » Sat Mar 12, 2016 3:26 pm

I was talking about this to an old mate yesterday. He uses a Lee bottom pour pot, and he said he had an old ladle I could have.
He rummaged around in a drawer and gave me this. I guess it will clean up OK.
IMG_1733.JPG
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Ohio3Wheels
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Re: Trouble casting new Money bullet

Post by Ohio3Wheels » Tue Mar 15, 2016 2:06 pm

My Lyman gets that "ugly" at times and yes they do clean up :) . Hopefully it will help with your mold. With my 40 cal molds I use the technique mention of starting horizontal and rotating vertical count to 3 or 4 and then let metal flow to form a good puddle on the sprue plate.

Make smoke,

Keith
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Re: Trouble casting new Money bullet

Post by Keith » Tue Mar 15, 2016 3:09 pm

Well that was easy and made all the difference. I should have done that years ago.
Thanks all for the advice :D
Just have to get them to shoot now.
The new method on the left and the old on the right. Sorry, the auto focus is on the ladel not the slugs but you get the picture.
Keith
money bullet.JPG
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bruce moulds
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Re: Trouble casting new Money bullet

Post by bruce moulds » Wed Mar 16, 2016 1:42 pm

keith,
that mould does not seem to be filling out properly.
nice bases, but the sides are not smooth.
keep safe,
bruce.

gunlaker
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Re: Trouble casting new Money bullet

Post by gunlaker » Sun Apr 24, 2016 8:32 am

bruce moulds wroteCOLONyou are right keith.
also, big sprues keep the plate hot, which aids in square bases.
800 degrees should be hot enough to get fillout, and if technique is good possibly 750 degrees will be good.
sometimes tilting the mated ladle/mould back and forth will induce air release.
counting to 3 as you rotate the mould/ladle from horizontal to vertical often helps as well.
keep safe,
bruce.
I thought I'd bring this back. Bruce several years ago I switched from bottom pouring to using the ladle. This was the best thing I've ever done for improving my bullets. When I made the transition I found 825 seemed to work well with all of my molds.

But, based on your post, I decided to cast three 100 bullet batches of BACO money bullets. The first at 800, the next at 775, and the last at 750. I was surprised to see that even at 750 the bullets were very well filled out. There was very little difference in average weight between the batches. Much less than I would have believed. The lower temperatures also allowed me to cast faster. From now on I'm going to use 775 degrees for my base pour molds, unless it's well below freezing outside. I'll still use th higher temp for my Hoch nose pour molds though.

One thing I should add for those new to casting. Preheating molds on a hot plate was the second best thing I've ever done with respect to casting. Reducing the temperature a bit just might be the third best.

Thanks Bruce.

Chris.

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