Got a Trapdoor

hoonza
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Got a Trapdoor

Post by hoonza » Sun Nov 20, 2005 2:57 pm

Hi All

Picked up a Trapdoor Springfield last year and have not shot it much. It is a hoot to shoot. I ordered up some 405 gr govt. bullet molds but have not got around to casting any yet. Winter Project, will get busy on that soon. Plan on just using wheel weights, as pure lead is hard to come by here in Alaska.

Hoonza

Hiwall
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Wheelweights

Post by Hiwall » Sun Nov 20, 2005 3:19 pm

Wheel weights are fine for fun shooting and general short range work. Watch out for contamination in your alloy. These weights now come from all corners of the world and may contain all sorts of different materials.
Stay warm,
tom patton

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Lee Stone
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Post by Lee Stone » Sun Nov 20, 2005 3:57 pm

Hoonza;

If you are not familiar with it, I would suggest the book "Loading Cartridges For The Original .45-70 Springfield Rifle And Carbine" by J.S. and Pat Wolf. It is a wealth of information on the trapdoors and will guide you through loading for that wonderful rifle. You can get the book from Pat's website (J.S. Wolf passed away several years ago, but Pat has carried the book on and now has it into it's third edition).

http://www.the45-70book.com/

This book is also a must read for any black powder shooting discipline.
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Tom Trevor
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trapdoor

Post by Tom Trevor » Sun Nov 20, 2005 5:54 pm

Lee have you read the book, say hello to pat for Cheryl and I :lol:

TexasMac
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Post by TexasMac » Sun Nov 20, 2005 10:06 pm

hoonza,

Using wheelweight alloy in standard .45-70 diameter bullets will almost always guaranteed poor accuracy in a trapdoor. Most, if not all, trapdoor bores have oversize groove diameters in the 0.460" to 0.463" range. You need soft lead alloy (around 30:1 or softer lead:tin mix) bullets to expand and seal the bore otherwise severe bore fouling will result. Wheelweights typically won't cut it. If you could find a mould or have a custom one made to fit the groove diameter, it likely will be too large a diameter to use due to the resulting cartridge exceeding TD chamber dimensions.

You may be able to get by using wheelweights if the bullets have a deep reverse cone base, facilitating sufficient and fast expansion, but don't bet on it.

Wayne
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Click on http://www.texas-mac.com/index.html to my home page containing information on my Browning/Winchester BPCR book & associated articles.

oldbluelight
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Post by oldbluelight » Mon Nov 21, 2005 10:45 am

In Wolfe's book on loading for original TDs one mold that he recommends is the Lee 405 hollow base. When I cast with this mold and a 20:1 lead/tin alloy the bullets drop out at .460". This is the diameter of the sizing die that I use to lubricate this bullet (another recommendation from Wolfe). If this is the mold you plan on using a WW bullet may cast at a different diameter and if you size it to modern dimensions of .457” you may not end up with a good fit. His recommendation of this bullet was based on the fact that a wide range of bore diameters are encountered in original TDs and this design's HB in a soft alloy (the Springfield Arsenal used 16:1 for the "official" bullets) allows the projectile to expand/swage to fit the bore. It may be that WW will not be as accommodating and might lead to leading problems (that looks like a pun but I swear it’s knot) if there is significant blow by from an undersized bullet. One thing that most original TD shooters agree on is that significant barrel wear will result from the use of modern jacketed bullets for a regular diet. And it’s a fact that the action wasn’t designed to deal with the pressures that many modern 45/70 smokeless loads produce. Have fun with the old warrior and let us know how the WW work out for you..

HvyMtl
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WW:

Post by HvyMtl » Mon Nov 21, 2005 7:23 pm

I just shot my Trap with BP for the first time, I used paper patched soft lead bullets. It shot great and the only problem I had was I still don't realy know what i'm doing, just giong along trying to figure it all out. How about if you take those WW bullets and paper patch them, this way you won't have to worry about blowby.

Ken

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Lee Stone
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Post by Lee Stone » Tue Nov 22, 2005 11:08 am

Tom;

Check you private messages.

Oh, and by the way, I most certainly have read the book. I need to go back and re-read it though.
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timberlake
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Post by timberlake » Wed Nov 23, 2005 5:30 pm

Lee,

I think you have the inside track on getting the Trapdoor to shoot. Pat's (and Spence's) book will certainly help get you there. Good luck.

TL

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Lee Stone
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Post by Lee Stone » Wed Nov 23, 2005 9:47 pm

Timberlake;

I am most fortunate. Thank you for your kind wishes. I will forward them on to Miss Pat.
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EDWARD MALINOWSKI
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Post by EDWARD MALINOWSKI » Thu Sep 14, 2006 4:27 pm

You need soft lead alloy (around 30:1 or softer lead:tin mix) bullets to expand and seal the bore otherwise severe bore fouling will result.

Amen TexasMac
Accuracy will be more than 2 inches at 100 yds. with harder alloy.



Ed Malinowski

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